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Thread: Sellers - Boycott eBay on Feb 20, 2008!!
Jouky
Registered User

From: N/A
Messages: 16
 Sellers - Boycott eBay on Feb 20, 2008!!
Sent: 02-10-2008 15:47
  Reply



Hello, sorry for the rather long post, but if you really want to understand how bad eBay and PayPal are going to rip off BOTH buyers and sellers, please read on.

There has been some comments that sellers are making a big noise over nothing. Actually the changes in eBay policy and fees will also impact buyers. I have calculated an example to show you the impact of the new fees and policy changes and the impact that they will have on both sellers and buyers. To make this comparison as fair as possible, I have not included any handling or shipping material charges - all numbers listed are actual costs for dealing with Canada Post, eBay & PayPal. I have even ignored the rip-off exchange rate that PayPal charges for Canadians to be able to withdraw US funds from their accounts.

The example is for an item listed in US dollars, shipped from Canada to a US address. BTW, the same example for Canada to Canada is very similar. For Canada to outside North America - the shipping charge increase is 200 to 1000% - I kid you not. Just as an example the shipping goes from $5.75 to $47.95 in the example below!

The example is for an item which was listed for $4.99, and which was bid up to $10 - this is in line for many of my items. Within this example are things such as computer memory sticks for older systems, soft cover books under 1/2 lb. etc. In other words, thing which will fit into a regular large envelope.

Today, to save on shipping costs I suggest that my buyers pay by personal check or money order. By avoiding PayPal I do not have to ship with tracking.

So here are the costs for a $10 item today:

- Listing fee: $0.40
- Final Value fee: $0.53
- Shipping: $4.20 - cost of shipping a large envelope at best available Canada Post rate
- Cost of stamp from the US for the check or money order: $0.69 (On most accounts money orders are free)

Total cost to the customer: $14.89

Total revenue to seller: $9.07

Total fees to eBay: $0.93

Now eBay policy states that for many items, PayPal must be used. PayPal policy states that shipments must include tracking. Not only that, but PayPal will hold the money for 3 weeks - so in essence the seller is making an interest free loan to PayPal for the 3 week float!

Exactly same example with the "improvements" that eBay has announced, for a $10 item:

- Listing fee: $0.35
- Final Value fee: $0.88
- Shipping: $13.20 (Cheapest rate available with tracking)
- PayPal fee: $1.22

Total cost to the customer: $23.20 - an increase of $8.31 or 156%

Total revenue to seller: $7.55 - a decrease of $1.52 or 17%

Total fees to eBay & PayPal: $2.45 - a whopping increase of $1.52 or 263%

So there you have it - both buyers and sellers are big losers, while eBay and PayPal are major winners. While a lot of people have been focusing on the eBay final value fees (as I did at first), the real impact can be seen if the complete picture is considered.

While the numbers change for different listing and final value fees, they remain similar.

Hopefully this will give you an understanding as to why there must be a boycott - and as far as I am concerned I will only end my boycott when eBay comes to its senses. But as you can see by the numbers, even if eBay looses half of its transactions, it is still ahead - this is why this boycott must be massive, otherwise eBay just laugh at us all the way to the bank!!!

Thanks,

Jouky

 




Death2eBay
New User

From: N/A
Messages: 3
 Sellers - Boycott eBay on Feb 20, 2008!!
Sent: 02-07-2008 11:13
  Reply



hi guys, im new to these forums, but like all of you, i share a certain hate for the ebay company.

so whats up with this boycott?

after being a loyal seller/buyer with ebay for many years, 10 or so suspended accounts for the stupidest reasons.. id like to join this boycott if its for real...

is it gonna be a huge thing? anyone got any other info on it..?

thanks

 




Basset
New User

From: East Tennessee
Messages: 1
 Sellers - Boycott eBay on Feb 20, 2008!!
Sent: 02-01-2008 16:36
  Reply



I'm there! I'm trying to get the last of my items listed, and sold before February 20. I'm not just boycotting......I'm quitting! I won't be back to ebay, unless things majorly change!

 




dragonlady
New User

From: N/A
Messages: 1
 Sellers - Boycott eBay on Feb 20, 2008!!
Sent: 02-01-2008 09:51
  Reply



The boycott is scheduled for the week starting Feb. 18th. No buying..no selling.

 




SellersAccounts
Big BOSS

From: Ebaysucks.com
Messages: 829
 Sellers - Boycott eBay on Feb 20, 2008!!
Sent: 01-30-2008 09:30
  Reply



Rose777, And now days 4 buyers can leave you negtaive feedback and poof your banned no matter what the negs are for they will banned you

f**k ebay

We regret to inform you that your eBay account has been suspended due to the violation of our site policy below:

* Minus 4 Feedback Rating - Feedback below eBay standards.

Due to the suspension of this account, please be advised you are prohibited from using eBay in any way. This includes the registering of a new account.

Please note that any seller fees due to eBay will immediately become due and payable. eBay will charge any amounts you have not previously disputed to the billing method currently on file.

 




Rose777
New User

From: USA
Messages: 3
 Sellers - Boycott eBay on Feb 20, 2008!!
Sent: 01-30-2008 05:33
  Reply



eBay is shooting themselves in the foot. I am a PowerSeller and have been on eBay many, many years so I speak from experience. I mean no disrespect but when you said, "I no longer receive any answers to my complaints, now just completely ignored by ebay customer service." Get real. None of us get answers to complaints and we are ALL completely ignored by eBay customer service.

More to the point. You major mistake was being "vocal". I've seen many "vocal" eBayers get booted from eBay, some of them big PowerSellers. The key is not to get vocal with eBay. The key is to let your actions speak for themselves.

If we don't sell on Feb. 20th we will be heard loud and clear. We can also do other things like close our stores, cancel Picture Manager, etc. THE ONLY thing eBay cares about is their bottom line.

It is time to flex what little muscle we have left.

 




WesternMarshal
New User

From: N/A
Messages: 5
 Sellers - Boycott eBay on Feb 20, 2008!!
Sent: 01-30-2008 03:18
  Reply



areyounuts, There is one thing you must be aware of regarding your proposed boycott of ebay on 2/20. I, as one of the culprits involved in the 2004 sellers boycott, am one of the few remaining sellers still listing (on occasion) that hasn't been suspended or voluntarily left the website. Ebay has since made my life miserable and I have accumulated enough documentation for MEGA litigation against the auction giant. However, finding an attorney willing to accept the case on a contingency basis, even though my case has outstanding merit, is simply out of the question. This is due not to having sufficient grounds, but not finding a law firm with deep enough pockets to accept the case, which would involve a tremendous amount of capital and resourses to take on ebay. Ebay could drag out the litigation for years at tens of thousands of dollars or more in cost! As you know, no matter how good your legal action may be, there is no guarantees, ESPECIALLY with the corruption in the court system (see Merck vs Ebay where the US Supreme court sided with ebay for the good of the country & economy?)

Ebay knows I have these grounds and perhaps that is why I am still listing on ebay. This all started from my participation as one of the so called ring-leaders of the 2004 boycott. Perhaps before you take any public action against ebay, read the current ebay policy that has been put in place since that 2004 boycott. It states in so many words (not verbatum), that anyone who proves to be controversal to ebay policy, having a negative effect on their bottom line, can be immediatly suspended FOR THE GOOD OF THE EBAY COMMUNITY! What may be good for your or I, may not be good for the bottom line of ebay. To affect that bottom line in a negative manner raises the ire of ebay management.

I no longer receive any answers to my complaints, now just completely ignored by ebay customer service. My ability to conduct free enterprise trade has been curbed, and I have suffered to no end at the hands of ebay. I have been unmercifully harrassed in every way possible, but I still believe the only reason I have not been axed from ebay is because of my written complaints to the fraud division of the California Attorney General's office!

This office investigated my complaints and reacted with what is still an on-going investigation. I have written replies from them to confirm that this isn't BS, but fact! For a change, they (CAG) have been making ebay jump through a few hoops of their own. In another words, if you are going to boycott ebay, COVER YOUR ASS IF YOU WANT TO REMAIN AS A SELLER! To put it more plainly, READ EBAY'S CURRENT POLICY, which they seem to be changing on nearly a daily basis! If you want to harrass them, voice your complaints directly to bill.cobb@ebay.com. Of course with his recent promotion, this email address will only be good for about another month from the date of this posting.

Good luck to you fellow ebay sellers, I hope your boycott produces results! I'd really like to participate, but for now I must lay back in the weeds. Voice your complaints of fraud and other matters of injustice and illegalities to the Federal Trade Commission, your home state Attorney General, your local BBB and also the BBB's in San Jose, CA and Omaha, NE (PayPal locale).

Regarding paypal refusing to pay claims, fraudulently taking your money, contact the Post Master General of the USPS. Bombarding these offices and others that I have not mentioned will produce more results than a boycott which may, and most likely fail, due to all the greed monster sellers with warehouses full of Chinese junk to unload on the unsuspecting public. Ebay has been trying to run off the small Mom & Pops sellers for years, and ditto for the small business owners using their website. For the MEGA MERCHANTS, ebay is much more profitable then having a brick & mortar establishment with working sales staff overhead!

As always, trying to help my fellow ebay sellers, the WesternMarshal!

 




Jouky
Registered User

From: N/A
Messages: 16
 Sellers - Boycott eBay on Feb 20, 2008!!
Sent: 01-29-2008 23:09
  Reply



Taurus11, Hello, you are so right. I really used to enjoy eBay and have sold and purchased quite a fair amount of items. It was fun, and although all the fees between eBay and PayPal averaged about 30% of my total revenues, it was a bit less work than other venues such as flea markets and such.

Now, the fees have increased so astronomically that considering the work of listing an item, packing it, etc. it is just not worthwhile anymore.

In case you have not fully reviewed the detail, while eBay has lowered the listing fees, they have increased the base final value fees by 67% - you got that right, this is not a typo - 67% increase!!!

Even with the reduction of the insertion fees, the total increase for a $10 item is 59%!!!

Great deal for eBay, but are you going to continue dealing with any company that increases its rates by this level? I will not!!

Jouky

 




Taurus11
New User

From: N/A
Messages: 1
 Sellers - Boycott eBay on Feb 20, 2008!!
Sent: 01-29-2008 21:45
  Reply



Jouky,

RIP EBAY.

What used to be a friendly place with informed buyers, and interesting used merchandise, has turned into a cesspool of scammers who demand they buy with only paypal, and sellers of flea-market import junk. These 'improvements' ebay has announced was not vetted with ANY members of the community in advance, and serves only to increase the average per-sale take of the combined auction and payment system. It is a disgrace.

The elimination of buyer feedback is the end. I have been an ebay seller for over 8 years, and mutual FB was one of the protections that afforded all member the ability to make a decision on the reputability of another user. Now that is being taken away. How does ebay *exactly* expect sellers to protect themselves against entitlement-****es who use something they bought for a month, before claiming there paypal credit-card payment was fraudulent? Ebay says buyers will not be able to leave seller feedback if NPB is not responded to, but what does that amount to? A buyer could respond with a single dot, and then leave FB for the transaction...

Ebay, may your venue rest in peace....

(My first, and probabbly last, post concerning ebay)

 




Jouky
Registered User

From: N/A
Messages: 16
 Sellers - Boycott eBay on Feb 20, 2008!!
Sent: 01-29-2008 21:05
  Reply



DMFK, Hello, you are so right, these moves by eBay are complete scams. The final value fee is up by 67%!!! The break even point is $1.43 - that is right, if you sell something for more than $1.43 you will be paying more fees than before. Some benefit!!!

As a seller, I have already been ripped off by dishonest buyers - now there is no protection whatsoever for sellers - this is Carte Blanche for dishonest buyers to rip sellers off, left right and center.

Just to make matters even worse, now one has to use PayPal for computer items, and then PayPal gets to keep the money for the most part of a month. Forget it!!!

Never mind Feb 20th - its goodbye to eBay and PayPal for me. There is no way that a honest seller can succeed under these circumstances. There are many other alternatives, and I think that once sellers start realizing how the eBay / PayPal combo is ripping them off, there will be no-one left selling on eBay except for the scammers. This should open the doors for someone else to offer a reasonable service.

eBay has had a good run, it is now committing corporate suicide, I for one do not intend to be drawn into its death dance.

Goodbye eBay, Goodbye PayPal.

Jouky

 




DMFK
New User

From: Georgia
Messages: 1
 Sellers - Boycott eBay on Feb 20, 2008!!
Sent: 01-29-2008 18:51
  Reply



eBay has made some changes that will take effect February 20, 2008. They are marketing a decrease in listing fees, coupled with benefits for buyers and sellers. The truth is that although listing fees re being slightly decreased (from 5 cents to 20% depending on item value), final value fees are being increased DRASTICALLY. PowerSellers get discounts, but it will not get them back to as good a situation as they are currently in!

More importantly, eBay is ELIMINATING NEGATIVE FEEDBACK for buyers!!! That means as a seller you cannot leave negative feedback for a buyer. You either leave positive feedback or no feedback!! This is what eBay is marketing as a benefit for buyers. Obviously it is a benefit for buyers...but buyers that represent the scum off the earth and certainly not the good, honest buyers that eBay should be trying to attract. This is a loss for honest buyers, a loss for sellers and a negative for the whole eBay community. Starting February 20, dishonest buyers will be able to delay and avoid payment with no serious consequences whatsoever! We all know about the three-strikes-and-you're-out for non-paying bidders. With no negative feedback allowed, all buyers essentially get a free pass to not pay for 2 items!!

As a call to arms, I strongly encourage all sellers to boycott eBay on February 20, 2008. Do not list any new items this day and remind eBay that it is sellers that matter most and that nobody on eBay wants protectionism for buyers that don't hold up their end of the deal!!! Better yet, find a new site to sell your items and never sell on eBay again!!!

 






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